Please clarify what happens if a team member is duping/griefing

hello,

a week ago some player on our server got his base/progress/inventory deleted because his "teammember" had duped a lot of stuff.

So i'm some kind of "major" with a big claim and several subdivision, so i got access to the items of every player living in the town.

I really don't want to risk my progress in future. So is it standard procedure for admins/mods to handle such cases?

because imho it can't be a mature decision to blame the entire group for one players misbehavior.

 

Heres what i was told when i found out my teammember was griefing..
If you have knowingly accepted Duped item then you are just as bad and your base will be leveled to...

 

absolutely agree with that.


also in the case i mentioned the player who got his stuff deleted actually made the ticket about his team-member...

 

I believe that if there is not any evidence that one member knew and excepted that the other was cheating, than there should be no punishment whatsoever. you know the whole innocent until proven guilty thing. heck if he turned in his friend for cheating then he should be rewarded!

 

Everything tied to the duper is removed to prevent duped items. We try to contain it to just his items and claims however it's hard to tell. We side on the side of caution in allowing duped items and regeneration their claims/items if in question.

We usually make exceptions and work with people that report dupers. To encourage positive behavior and get people to not allow this behavior.

 

There i think my new signature shows why its necessary at all to disable exploits.

what do you think?

Spoiler: This is it incase i change it in the future

In a perfect world we would not need to disable dupe glitches and exploits, or restrict what can and cannot be sold on the market, because minecraft is a sandbox game meaning that you can choose how you play. If people knew what they wanted then they would be able to choose if they wanted to use a dupe bug and skip ahead or not, or choose if they want to skip ahead by using the market to buy endgame items. But this is not a perfect world and most people do not know what they want so we do need to disable opportunities like this.

 

Personally, dupe bugs don't bother me. People are welcome to use them. If someone playing on the same server as I am chooses to dupe, it doesn't really affect me. If someone wants 1,000, or 100,000 diamond blocks, more power to them. Their inventory doesn't affect my gameplay. However, when the admins choose to disable a machine or a block that I'm using, and it vanishes from the world, taking my inventory with it, and they decline to replace the things that were lost, then it most certainly affects me.

I'm not in a competition with anyone else here. There doesn't need to be a level playing field for me to have fun, and build what I'd like to build.

 

This is a good way to look at things for the most part as only how you play the game should affect your progress, however the items duped tend to worm their way onto the market which sadly leads to huge imbalances in the economy of the server. Whenever i have seen duping of items i always feel like people lose sight of why they play. The game becomes about how many stacks of resource blocks we have instead of how beautiful our creation is or how compact our processing system is. In the end those who aren't caught duping usually end up quitting anyway because the game has lost it's appeal.
Regardless of the philosophical reasoning of why people dupe or don't dupe the original question about what happens needs a thorough answer. Depending on the circumstances most times only those guilty of duping (or who knew a person was duping and accepted items from them) are punished for it. in extreme cases when the level of duplication is unsure a complete base regeneration is done to prevent any possible duped items from being distributed. The best advice for if you are afraid someone is duping on your claim is report them and work with the staff to get it resolved. They will do their best to remove only the duped items and to keep innocent players happy.

 

I'm not sure the economy of the server really suffers. You might see inflationary action, as the glut of goods starts devaluing the MyM. In theory, that would make it tougher for new players, who don't have the established bank accounts. Of course, you might also see new players have an easier time, since the market might have cheap goods it wouldn't otherwise have. Personally, I find the second scenario more common. In my experience, cheap/free access to commondities results in lower costs to the community.


Regardless, I don't think the server fails or succeeds based on this. In my travels, I've found that what makes a server a success is the sense of community. If it's a place where people enjoy hanging out, and it doesn't crash often, it will be a server with longevity, regardless of how devalued, or strong, the MyM is against some arbitrary baseline.

As for people quitting because someone else duped items, or flooded the market with diamond blocks and never got banned, we come back to people needing to lose the sense that this is a competition. When more people find the inner satisfaction with their game experience, and stop measuring it against other people's successes, or failures, it will cease to matter as much what your neighbor 'has'.

Of course, actual mileage may vary.

Edit:
The thing that almost made me quit, wasn't somebody duping. It was getting things deleted from my base that I was using legitimately, and losing everything they contained, and getting the standard "We don't replace lost items" company line. Bad customer service will lose me faster than a 'cheating' player.

 

Market is my main income for claimblocks, because i vote for chunkloader tickets.

And here it comes to the point where it affects me as player. Because i worked for every item i'm putting on market, and/or invested lots of time to get them. mfr laser for diamonds for example takes lots of time because you need a steady power supply.

While the duper just takes a stack of Diamondblocks, dupes them, and puts them on market.

So a cheating person is able to sell expensive stuff even in early game.

 

Certainly true. This is greatly dependent on your server. I play on Civilization, and there's nothing that a duper could post that would significantly impact my gameplay. If they're duping something I sell, there's other things to sell. If your economy depends on a single item retaining value, you're going to get in trouble anyhow if someone comes along that sells them cheaper just because they have a bigger system, or care less about making an income.

We're humans. We adapt. In the beginning of the server, a thinking businessperson will sell swords. Then, when people start buying swords, sell armor to protect those people from the swords that everyone has. Then when people start losing their stuff because they're all fighting, sell soulbound books to help them keep their stuff. This is a specific example, the take-away is that a duper producing a billion diamond blocks will 1) Get caught and banned, and 2) Drive down, temporarily, the cost of diamond blocks. That hardly "crashes" an economy. It may create a momentary bump, or dip, in a single commodity, or a small group of commodities, but it hardly turns into the flaming ball of server-ending cataclysm that people seem to talk about,

 

If you donate a small amount you get claimblocks daily

 

so T3 rank gives 1k blocks daily? I thought that it's a onetime bonus?!

 

Nah nah nah I get 2400 daily as I'm T5

 

That would be an isolated incident, and one that is easily discovered and rectified. The lag will assuredly draw the attention of people such as yourself, and then, duping notwithstanding, the base would be wiped/regressed since it was causing performance issues for the server anyhow. Whatever the machine, if they duped 20 of them and set them up, and it caused issues, would they not see exactly the same result as if they'd legitimately made 20 of them? If they want 20, or 50, or whatever number freaks everything out, they'll likely build them anyhow, even if they can't dupe. It'll just take more time to get there. And, yes, of course, some people won't bother.

I was, more or less, agreeing with Slind when he was saying that, if you disable every possible duping situation, you break some mods completely. There is a balance between making the server unplayable and allowing some exploits to exist. I lean towards the "leave some exploits open rather than create a maximum security lockdown" scenario.

I think I conveyed my feelings poorly... I don't condone duping, nor do I think it should be allowed to run rampant. However, every time a ban is implemented on something, there's both a positive, and a negative result. In some cases, the negative obviously outweighs the positive. In my case, the loss of days of productivity by a machine that stored its own output was frustrating, and I certainly questioned whether someone was breaking the server with whatever exploit existed for that piece of equipment, because it frustrated me to have to go back and remake the assembly line, and start production all over, especially if the problem could have been solved in a more targeted manner.

Meanwhile, if someone is actually duping on a scale large enough to cause performance issues, or crash an economy, it will be readily apparent before very long. Appropriate punishment can still occur. If, indeed, anyone was actually exploiting the issue on the Civ server, I'm sure it could have been sussed out without a global ban on the Crafter, and subsequent fallout, and the offending party reminded of the error of their ways.

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I just discovered this myself...

 

No doubt that staff won't handle that.

But we get slightly offtopic, as the main question was more target about progress of innocent players.


I've attached some screenshots to better show of what made me wonder about the whole situation.

So the cheater only played in the last month as the stats show. while the other person who got also everything deleted played almost 4x the time, and also before the cheater really started playing on the server.

So he lost 11days of playtime progress, because of his ignorant neighbour...