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Thaumcraft 'Easy Research' is horrible

Discussion in 'Suggestions and Feedback' started by Millumi, Dec 9, 2015.

  1. Millumi

    Millumi Well-Known Member

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    I've played on a lot of servers with thaumcraft, but this is my first time seeing something change it so the research table is no longer required for research, when I asked what was going on, I was told this was some sort of thing added in to make research easy.
    Utterly Ridiculous. While I get that this thing helps people who don't know about thaumcraft and only want early game stuff, it is absolutely PUNISHING to those who know what they are doing and are deeply into the mod. The reason? Aspects.

    With normal research, you spend quite a bit of aspects to go through the mini-game of connecting the dots to get the research, but with this add-on, you have to spend a predetermined number of points on each piece of research, why this is bad is immediately obvious to anyone who knows thaumcraft: You can't choose which aspects you are spending. Here are the aspects that are in almost all the research: Instrumentum, Ordo, Praecatatio, permutatio, and tutamen to a lesser extent.
    The fatigue on research is to a very high extent when you need the same aspects over and over again, and not only does it make the mod much harder to get to the late game, it also ruins the journey to get there, what makes thaumcraft progression interesting/fun isn't only the connecting things on the minigame, but being able to take from many things you've scanned in the world, and put that into your research.When it's restricted to only the aspects to buy the research, most of the aspects end up being nearly useless.

    Anyone else feel similar to me?
     
  2. chugga_fan

    chugga_fan ME 4M storage cell of knowledge, all the time

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    Argument made before, apparently no one else except people who knew and loved thaumcraft cared
     
  3. Slind

    Slind Founder

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    BookerTheGeek likes this.
  4. Millumi

    Millumi Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure the poll for the implemented thaumcraft research should be trusted. I mean, the whole conversation shifts in that topic so much that the question posed by the poll separated from the discussion is completely different.
     
  5. chugga_fan

    chugga_fan ME 4M storage cell of knowledge, all the time

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    The thing is, you can't change people's minds on the internet, very hard, so there's no point
     
  6. Millumi

    Millumi Well-Known Member

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    Really though, I just made this topic as feedback, if enough people start complaining, anything can change.


    If anyone has a legit defence of the so-called 'easy' research, I'd love to hear it.
     
  7. Rebelborn

    Rebelborn Well-Known Member

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    i have done thaumcraft so many times. it get boring to do all the repitivly reserch over and over again. its just waste of time. if u realy want to do it the hard way play in sp.
     
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  8. julio1237878

    julio1237878 Game enthusiastic

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    I am with you after they change thaumcraft i have not touch the mod ever since but like chugga said its hard to change peoples mind
     
  9. chaosblad3

    chaosblad3 Very Well-Known Member

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    One thing we could try on modpacks like Infinity or Regrowth where we have multiple nodes is have it set to easy mode on one node and normal mode on another so that way people can choose which system they want to use to unlock research simply by switching server..

    E.g. keep all node 1's set to easy mode but set all node 2's to normal mode

    Obviously this doesn't help people on modpacks where we only have the one server, or the people who started playing on the infinity node 3's since they're standalone, but at least it would give some people the option to use normal mode research if they really want to.. also I'm sure that a lot of people currently on a node 2 might get annoyed at being forced to switch to node 1 to continue doing research in easy mode etc but as they say "you just can't please everyone" :/


    Kinda surprised that we don't have all of the infinity evolved expert servers set to hard research mode anyway tbh ;)
     
  10. chugga_fan

    chugga_fan ME 4M storage cell of knowledge, all the time

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    That should be set to true, cuz it's infinity HARD MODE
     
  11. Millumi

    Millumi Well-Known Member

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    But the thing is, 'easy' mode IS the hard way.
    Thaumcraft is a lot harder when you need a lot of the same aspects.
    The original intention of the approved suggestion was to make thaumcraft EASIER, if the implementation fails to do that, why keep it?
     
  12. julio1237878

    julio1237878 Game enthusiastic

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    I could say the same to you rebel if thaumcraft was not set to easy ever since that change it made my favorite mod a nightmare and i had to abandon it never touch it again but the thing is those changes only make half of the community happy while the others who does not like it has to stay in the darkness being force to do what the other half like
     
  13. Rebelborn

    Rebelborn Well-Known Member

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    i see that one. not the best ex. this is a hard thing tho. so many player and all want it ther way. i think it shuld be up to the admin/manager to decide this and not the player base.
     
  14. chugga_fan

    chugga_fan ME 4M storage cell of knowledge, all the time

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    The best decider IS the playerbase, to please the majority
     
  15. Rebelborn

    Rebelborn Well-Known Member

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    in many thing it is. but whit thaumcraft the player base is split ca 50-50. i know som of the admins/manager isent playing mc. they do it for the coding and technical stuff. i belive they ar the best to dicide this
     
  16. Millumi

    Millumi Well-Known Member

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    3 things. 1. The default is having the research on. This means it's the way the mod developer intended it to be played.
    2. I'm not sure it's as 50/50 as everyone thinks it is.
    3. The current situation is the result of the community getting what they thought they wanted, without fully thinking through the negative consequences.
     
  17. LLitaTroll

    LLitaTroll Well-Known Member

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    As currently implemented, I vote that "easy research" is terrible. You could make it work if you balanced the different aspect research points. Arguably, you could also make it work if some basic scan items gave 1000 or so of the primal aspects. This would allow players to combine the aspects to get the research aspects needed, effectively making the mini game/research table more "easy mode", but without stranding players who are trying to progress.
     
  18. matijase

    matijase Well-Known Member

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    The only solution to this argument is that players could change the dificulty themselwes, but that is work in progress.
     
  19. chaosblad3

    chaosblad3 Very Well-Known Member

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    Since needing more research points seem to be the main issue people have with easy mode, perhaps we could just add a custom recipe for knowledge fragments to balance things out since each give 1-2 of each primal but in a way that still fits the theme and requires a bit of work and materials, e.g.
    [​IMG]
    Code:
    mods.thaumcraft.Arcane.addShapeless("BASICARTIFACE", <Thaumcraft:ItemResource:9>*9, "aer 9, terra 9, ignis 9, aqua 9, ordo 9, perditio 9", [<Thaumcraft:ItemThaumonomicon>]);
    Just a suggestion though, I won't implement it unless enough people want it ;)
    1 like = 1 vote [​IMG]
     
  20. PhantomRTW

    PhantomRTW Retired Staff

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    Its not hard to get research points for these things.

    Scour the Deep Dark, literally thousands of nodes there. After an hour you would have all you needed.
    Capture/spawn crimson knights. They drop knowledge fragments as loot.

    The argument that "easy mode" makes it "harder" just isn't true.

    (Of course these options are not valid on servers without a way to spawn mobs, or without the DD, but most packs include one or the other, or both.)
     
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